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PostPosted: July 13th, 2017, 7:08 am 
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Joined: July 13th, 2017, 6:31 am
Posts: 17
Location: Bulgaria
Dear colleagues,
I have Honda Transalp 650 cc (XL650V), p.y 2002, as the problem is that is going interrupting (total stop) the engine work, as you switch off the run key. The thing what is interesting that I can ride 50 – 100 km and more, and when I leave the machine for a while, after that has normal start and acceleration and in few kilometers, usually starts fast to lose power (as interruption) and the engine stops as no fuel. Usually after this the engine cannot run normal, on starter no result (does no matter how many times to try), but there is electricity. The last time I pulled the petrol sucker by hand on max position and the engine got started, I was waiting half minute because if move acceleration handle, shall stop. I moved back the position of petrol sucker and the motorbike got keeping himself as has never been the problem happened. After that as rocket, no problem to the next way. Already this is going to be permanent problem, because for 2 weeks happened over 3-4 times. In some cases I resolved the problem as was pumping manual the vacuum hose, as on fantasy the engine run. I put the motorbike before 3 days in box, as the mechanic said that there is no any problem. The tank was clean, the vacuum tap (petcock) is working, were cleaned carburetors and adjusted, new sparks, oil filters, brake fluid full check. I went to another one mechanic for opinion, as he is not sure too, he supposed the petcock, but it works. I shall be glad is you share your opinion, or to give m some suggestions if any, to find the way to resolve this unpleasant problem. I am thinking in direction for some electrical problem, or CDI? No idea really.
Thank you in advance and looking forward your support!


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PostPosted: July 13th, 2017, 7:53 am 
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Joined: July 14th, 2014, 4:55 pm
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Location: California USA
Hi there,

Welcome to the forum. Please fill out your location in your profile section.

Your translation is a little difficult to understand, but I think you are on the right track with the fuel being the problem. I don't know much about the XL650V CDI unit except what I see of this board and that it is pretty reliable compared to the early XL600s.

I would ride it and when it quit running, pull the fuel hose off the petcock, not the vacuum hose, and try to start the motor. At that point there should be fuel running out of the petcock. If there is then the problem is somewhere else. If there is no fuel coming out then the problem is in the petcock or fuel tank.

Also check that the breather for the tank is not plugged. If no air can get in, then no gas can get out.

To check this, ride the bike until it stops and then open the gas tank filler cap and try to start it again. If it starts again then the breather is plugged.

Let us know what you find.

_________________
Ride Now, Work Later!

89 Transalp XL600V X3, 01 Goldwing GL1800, 99 Varadero XL1000V
05 CRF450X Plated, 01 XR650L, 84 Passport C70


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PostPosted: July 13th, 2017, 10:31 am 
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Joined: July 13th, 2017, 6:31 am
Posts: 17
Location: Bulgaria
Hello!
Thank you for your response, as it sounds so logical and if I be honest, I didn’t suppose that this can be also the reason of the problem. Sure I shall try to follow your advices, and will be good if find the problem. I am sorry for my explanation, maybe my English is not so reliable, but I shall put on attention the note. Shall send feedback.


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PostPosted: July 14th, 2017, 2:07 am 
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Joined: July 8th, 2011, 7:02 am
Posts: 1064
Location: Mackay, Queensland, Australia
I own a 2003 Transalp XL650V which I've owned from new. I've had no problems with the CDI, or the fuel tap vacuum (no on / off / prime on the '03 model), or with the tank breather, so I was going to suggest what Skyliner has already written above.
I can't think of anything else.

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Born to be MILD
2003 Honda XL650V Transalp; 1977 Kawasaki Z750B twin;
2006 Hyosung GT250R; 2001 Yamaha FZS1000.


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PostPosted: July 16th, 2017, 10:04 am 
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Joined: July 13th, 2017, 6:31 am
Posts: 17
Location: Bulgaria
In moments of interruption and stops, (happened 3-4 times for these days), On road I was opening the tank cap, as you recommended, and I was good surprised that the engine got start, ok from 2-3 tries, but runs. First I decided to try with cap opening, do not unplug the gasoline hose from petcock. The most interesting, was as I saw that when I am riding, and leave the motorbike for a while, in the tank the pressure increasing, and the tap few times has opened up with outgoing pressure as tap of bottle spark drink. It seems inside of the tank is going pressure, if unlock. To begin I have looked on tap, I did not find the way to disassemble it. Just cleaned with special spray and compressed air. What I did further, first removed the fuel tank, and made inspection of all pipes in/out streams of petrol and air. Everything was ok, when I was blowing to the pipe ways. After that have cheeked the houses below, and on one of them (thin one, connected to the relevant pipe, bottom of the tank, see attached picture red cycle) it was not possible to blow in, it seems there is one way valve, somewhere down. On back direction (vacuum) no problem, and I think have to be in this way, but I decided to unplug the last one hose from the pipe and to ride, for test, to see does the problem will continue. Two days I am riding, and no problem, but on short distances and the weather is cool, not hot as few days before. Shall see, and if interrupt again definitely will try to unplug the main hose directly from the petcock, according the previous advice. Have to see what is going on.
Thank you so much, Dear colleagues, I am so glad to meet your attention about my problem!
Speak soon!


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PostPosted: July 16th, 2017, 10:22 am 
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Joined: July 14th, 2014, 4:55 pm
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Location: California USA
Again, I'm not familiar with the 650, but I think one of those outlets at the back of the tank is the water drain from under the gas cap. One of the other members here had a problem of when that drain hose was kinked, the tube that runs inside the tank rusted and it started leaking gas when the hose was unkinked. Anyway it sound like you are getting it figured out. Does the problem act any different with a full tank of gas compared to when it is almost empty?

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Ride Now, Work Later!

89 Transalp XL600V X3, 01 Goldwing GL1800, 99 Varadero XL1000V
05 CRF450X Plated, 01 XR650L, 84 Passport C70


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PostPosted: July 16th, 2017, 11:25 am 
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Joined: July 13th, 2017, 6:31 am
Posts: 17
Location: Bulgaria
One mechanic said me to ride with unplugged thin hose (vacuum), but this pipe (tube) has end somewhere on top, inside of the tank, maybe you are right, to collect water condensation, I think is not possible to arise some leaking of fuel, but who knows. On full tank or empty no difference, just happen.


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PostPosted: July 17th, 2017, 3:38 am 
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Joined: July 8th, 2011, 7:02 am
Posts: 1064
Location: Mackay, Queensland, Australia
Two hoses go to the under side of the tank. One is the drain for the cap recess, and if it gets clogged for long enough, the pipe through the tank rusts through allowing fuel to slowly leak from the drain. I can't remember the purpose of the other tube, but I don't think either is a vacuum hose.
I am currently 1000km from my Transalp so I can't check what that tube does.

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Born to be MILD
2003 Honda XL650V Transalp; 1977 Kawasaki Z750B twin;
2006 Hyosung GT250R; 2001 Yamaha FZS1000.


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PostPosted: July 25th, 2017, 12:46 pm 
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Joined: July 25th, 2017, 11:31 am
Posts: 1
Hello,

It looks like we have the same problem at the same time with the same bike. :) A XL650 from 2001.

Last week I changed the air filter (under the tank), disconnected the 2 hoses at the back of the tank (breather and overflow), did not disconnect the fuel and vacuum hose on the front of the tank. Put new air filter in, put tank back on the bike, put the hoses (breather and overflow) on the backside of the tank back to the correct 'tube'.

Started driving , after a couple of kms the engine starts to act strange, seems like it is not getting any fuel. Checked the 2 hoses, the bigger hose was a bit pinched. Straightened the hose and went back to driving. Seemed ok.

Did a 500km tour this weekend, same issue. But when I open the tank when the engine starts failing I can hear the tank sucking air into it, which means the tank is getting sucked vacuum and is underpressurized.
The consumed gasoline is not being replaced with air.

So the breather hose also seems to be the problem here.

But which of the 2 hoses on the back of the tank is the breather hose? The smaller or bigger tube?
Is it really a one-way hose with a valve in it like mentioned above?

Thank you!


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PostPosted: July 25th, 2017, 2:01 pm 
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Joined: July 14th, 2014, 4:55 pm
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Location: California USA
One of the under tank pipes goes to the valley under the gas cap. It is for if you overfill you tank, gas will run down that drain and onto the ground instead of over the outside of the tank and onto the hot motor. it should be the bigger pipe. I would think you should be able to blow air through it easily.

The other pipe should be the breather.

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Ride Now, Work Later!

89 Transalp XL600V X3, 01 Goldwing GL1800, 99 Varadero XL1000V
05 CRF450X Plated, 01 XR650L, 84 Passport C70


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PostPosted: July 30th, 2017, 10:59 am 
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Joined: July 13th, 2017, 6:31 am
Posts: 17
Location: Bulgaria
Hi! So, I was riding my motorbike with unplugged vacuum (5mm) hose until few days, and did not interrupt or has stop. I put back on the place this hose and already 5 days no problem, ok I am riding on short distances but shall I test it more intensive, I hope the problem is resolved, but we will see …


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PostPosted: July 30th, 2017, 3:23 pm 
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Location: California USA
That's good to hear. It definitely sounds like you are on the right track.

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Ride Now, Work Later!

89 Transalp XL600V X3, 01 Goldwing GL1800, 99 Varadero XL1000V
05 CRF450X Plated, 01 XR650L, 84 Passport C70


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PostPosted: August 6th, 2017, 7:32 am 
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Joined: July 13th, 2017, 6:31 am
Posts: 17
Location: Bulgaria
Hi! Yes, I was thinking that I am on the right way, but what happened is interesting to share. Now I am riding my motorbike in default set up, regarding manual instructions, but again shall talk for this vacuum hose, which now is on his place and no interruptions or stops, but again arose pressure in the tank, when the tap has open the unpleasant noise is going from there. Do you think will be good idea to eliminate this hose and on his place to insert new one which to works separately, without any connection with the previous one?


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PostPosted: August 6th, 2017, 8:51 am 
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Joined: July 14th, 2014, 4:55 pm
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Location: California USA
I'm not familiar enough with the 650, but if it were a California model that breather hose would be going to a canister and from that canister to the air box where it would suck all the fumes from the gas tank into the air box and into the engine. There would also be a 3rd hose coming from the canister to the open air to vent the canister. If any of those hoses were kinked it would cause you trouble. Also in California we would remove that canister and run the breather hoses out the bottom of the bike somewhere because that is the way we are.

_________________
Ride Now, Work Later!

89 Transalp XL600V X3, 01 Goldwing GL1800, 99 Varadero XL1000V
05 CRF450X Plated, 01 XR650L, 84 Passport C70


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PostPosted: August 7th, 2017, 7:40 am 
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Joined: July 13th, 2017, 6:31 am
Posts: 17
Location: Bulgaria
I checked different variants, and made few tests in default and non default condition, and in this context, I decided to disassemble the fuel cap of the tank, and colleagues, guess what I saw? The place of the spring which is pushing the rubber up is empty, no spring no nothing. I am sure the problem is coming from there, because the fuel tank is not breathing correct. No pass from cap. So I made total demount of the cap, cleaned up with special spray everything, and shall recycle the cap in her default condition, and I am pretty sure have to finish with that ...


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PostPosted: August 8th, 2017, 12:17 am 
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Joined: June 12th, 2016, 2:38 am
Posts: 116
Location: Tauranga, NZ
Does 650 have the arrow on the fuel cap? If yes, remember to put it back the right way! The arrow should be pointing forward when cap is closed.

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I'm from Finland, live in NZ and ride Transalp XL600VR 1995


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PostPosted: August 8th, 2017, 11:01 am 
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Joined: July 13th, 2017, 6:31 am
Posts: 17
Location: Bulgaria
Hi again! The problem becomes from the fuel cap, all the ways going to there, cant ventilate incoming air, going pressure inside, the small hose on the bottom of the tank has one way valve and just sucking, no way to pass back, and when the cap can’t pass out this air, there is going balloon effect, which is the source of the problem. The cap has arrow to front install, and cant be install in wrong direction.
What I did:
- Demount the cap total – saw that one spring missing on the position in red
- Inserted new spring and fix on back way the cap to default condition – I was riding in that way, but unfortunately it seems the cap wasn’t ok as function. The problem continue.
- I saw that and with spring there is no way the system to get out the air because everything is matching without any clearance between main body and the locking system of the cap. The one way the air to go trough is around the key bullet, but this didn’t happen.
- To remark that everything was well cleaned. I decided to make small hole 1 mm on the lowest place of the cap, and everything get back on place, no gas compression of the air, the motorbike has no interruptions, and I did not sense smell of gasoline steams or evaporation of some.
- Just when I leave the motorbike in the garage with hot engine, while the tank and the engine is hot can sense light smell of gasoline, just on distance less than half meter from the fuel cap. No problem I think.

To drive in that way I think is safety, but can install some membrane around the hole. Now the petrol tank is breathing normal, and the theme has already end.

I would like to say one big Thank you to all of you!!!


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PostPosted: August 23rd, 2017, 4:57 am 
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Joined: July 8th, 2011, 7:02 am
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Location: Mackay, Queensland, Australia
Zarkooo, I am glad to read that you have been able to solve your problem and get your bike running properly. Enjoy the fruits of your labours.

_________________
Born to be MILD
2003 Honda XL650V Transalp; 1977 Kawasaki Z750B twin;
2006 Hyosung GT250R; 2001 Yamaha FZS1000.


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